Status Meetings:2008-01-16:Log

[11:45pm] You were promoted to operator by chanserv.
[11:45pm] You changed the topic to "http://wiki.caminobrowser.org/Status_Meetings:2008-01-16:Agenda".
[11:51am] smorgan joined the chat room.
[12:00pm] smorgan was promoted to operator by you.
[12:00pm] cl joined the chat room.
[12:01pm] cl was promoted to operator by you.
[12:01pm] mento joined the chat room.
[12:01pm] mento was promoted to operator by chanserv.
[12:01pm] kreeger joined the chat room.
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[12:01pm] peeja joined the chat room.
[12:02pm] peeja was promoted to operator by you.
[12:02pm] ardissone|away: are we having a pink today?
[12:02pm] ardissone|away: guesses no
[12:04pm] ardissone|away: ok
[12:04pm] ardissone|away: everyone open http://wiki.caminobrowser.org/Status_Meetings:2008-01-16:Agenda in your camino
[12:05pm] ardissone|away: absolutely nothing new about a1
[12:05pm] ardissone|away: it's very boring 
[12:05pm] ardissone|away: b1
[12:06pm] ardissone|away: the plan is currently to finish relnotes and mento will build this afternoon-ish
[12:06pm] mento: ok
[12:07pm] ardissone|away: sam was having too much fun last night to help we work out the awkward phrasing that was left
[12:07pm] ardissone|away: so relnotes might take longer than in the past
[12:07pm] ardissone|away: then release b1 tomorrow
[12:08pm] ardissone|away: hopefully getting a bit wider release w/o the update sites trumpeting "new camino, install this" 
[12:08pm] smorgan: We should hold off on announcing it, or explicitly ask people to try to use update rather than downloading if they have a1
[12:09pm] ardissone|away: yes
[12:09pm] ardissone|away: thanks for reminding me
[12:09pm] mento: good call
[12:10pm] ardissone|away: i was going to file a bug blocking the release about update, but i got distracted
[12:10pm] ardissone|away: do we want to play moco
[12:11pm] ardissone|away: put it out there thurs, and announce tues?
[12:11pm] ardissone|away: that seems a bit long of a lag to me (and i don't think sam would like it, were he here to comment)
[12:12pm] smorgan: A couple days should be enough
[12:12pm] smorgan: Oh, I'll need to make a manifest tonight or tomorrow morning
[12:12pm] ardissone|away: yeah
[12:12pm] ardissone|away: that was the bug i was going to file
[12:13pm] ardissone|away: ss: if you're awake, please comment 
[12:14pm] ardissone|away: ok
[12:14pm] ardissone|away: i guess Mon then, since i don't think we want to announce on the weekend
[12:16pm] ardissone|away: anything else on b1?
[12:18pm] ardissone|away: 1.6 general updates
[12:19pm] ardissone|away: peeja: any news on the AS bugs?
[12:19pm] peeja: I'll be tackling at least one AS bug today
[12:19pm] ardissone|away:
[12:19pm] peeja: depending on how tenacious 1 or 2 of them are
[12:20pm] peeja: sorry, job hunting has been consuming my life 
[12:20pm] ardissone|away: understandable 
[12:21pm] ardissone|away: we'll see how swupdate goes very soon 
[12:21pm] ardissone|away: jeff was continuing to work on tab dragging
[12:22pm] ardissone|away: aiui, he hit a bit of a wall trying to make dragging also scroll the tabs once you hit either edge of the window
[12:22pm] smorgan: I'll fix web features by fiat shortly if no-one objects to my mock 
[12:22pm] ardissone|away: sam and i suggested to jeff that rather than make dragging perfect right now
[12:23pm] ardissone|away: we get the existing code polished and landed, so dragging within window-width works
[12:23pm] ardissone|away: which at least gets us partiy with Fx
[12:24pm] ardissone|away: i think we'll be waiting for the weekend for a new patch from batwood
[12:25pm] ardissone|away: but hopefully we can get it in asap so there's plenty of post-b1 testing before b2
[12:25pm] mento: fwiw, apple can't even get dragging + scrolling to work reliably
[12:25pm] ardissone|away: in case anything snuck by smorgan or mento (haha)
[12:25pm] ardissone|away: good
[12:25pm] ardissone|away: i kept meaning to check sfri
[12:25pm] mento: i don't know about safari
[12:25pm] mento: i'm talking about trying to drag to a spring-loaded finder folder
[12:25pm] ardissone|away: ah
[12:25pm] smorgan: Safari doesn't scroll
[12:26pm] smorgan: So that makes doing drag+scroll tricky 
[12:26pm] ardissone|away: so, we'd have parity with both sfri and fx
[12:26pm] ardissone|away: and then we'll lap 'em
[12:26pm] mento:
[12:27pm] ardissone|away: murph's been working on follow-up bugs on search; dunno if he'd done anything on the window-wide tab chain
[12:27pm] ardissone|away: AS feed handlers are virtually done (i hope)
[12:28pm] ss: (Sorry, I'm late. Monday is fine to announce as long as we have preview.cb.o live)
[12:28pm] ardissone|away: the big thing left is whether we do mento's exec thing, I think
[12:28pm] mento: that shouldn't hold up feed handlers
[12:28pm] mento: should be a followup
[12:28pm] ardissone|away: ok
[12:29pm] ardissone|away: then i'll spin a patch with the last of peeja's comments later and head for sr
[12:29pm] mento: is that for b1?
[12:29pm] ardissone|away: b2
[12:29pm] ardissone|away: b1 is done 
[12:29pm] ardissone|away: except for relnotes
[12:29pm] mento: the notes aren't 
[12:29pm] ss: (Thank godness)
[12:29pm] ardissone|away: unless someone knows of any pressing other bug
[12:30pm] ss: I'll look at relnote in an hour or so.
[12:30pm] ss: (Typing might be bad, btw.)
[12:30pm] ardissone|away: sounds good
[12:30pm] ardissone|away: yay shuttle!
[12:30pm] ardissone|away: symbol-stripping bug
[12:30pm] ardissone|away: ss: any info yet?
[12:30pm] ss: Nope
[12:31pm] ss: I'm of the opinion we should land it and ask questions later.
[12:31pm] ss: Especially since we're not shipping it.
[12:31pm] mento: anyone up for reviewing it?
[12:31pm] ss: Easier to ask for forgiveness and all that...
[12:31pm] mento: just the diff between strip and tease should be sufficient
[12:31pm] mento: maybe someone wants to look at the makefile too
[12:31pm] ss: Camino just crashed on me twice in a row with no symbols...
[12:32pm] mento: and there'll be a quick patch to installer/makefile.in as a followup, to make it use tease
[12:33pm] ardissone|away: mhm
[12:33pm] ardissone|away: which segues into the next item
[12:33pm] ardissone|away: updates from our breakpad team?
[12:33pm] mento: i am in ted's debt for reviews first
[12:33pm] smorgan: Nothing from me yet; hopefully this weekend
[12:33pm] ardissone|away: k
[12:34pm] ardissone|away: mento: you two can fight over the first responder when you review that 
[12:34pm] mento: ha
[12:34pm] ardissone|away: that's convinced me that using placeholder-text only is not good UI 
[12:35pm] ardissone|away: anyway
[12:35pm] ardissone|away: nothing new and exciting on 1.5.4
[12:35pm] ardissone|away: after we finish b1, in guess we can start landing things to be ready for gecko
[12:35pm] ss: '1.5.5 soon though
[12:35pm] ardissone|away: right
[12:36pm] ss: Because Gecko is soon ish. Freezing this week, hopefully.
[12:36pm] ardissone|away: oh, wow
[12:36pm] ss: Feb 5 is the target
[12:36pm] ardissone|away: so, yeah, next week landing for 1.5.5
[12:36pm] ss: has a schedule at wikimo/Releases
[12:37pm] mento: ardissone|away: beware, i might switch ppc to gcc 4.0 after tease lands
[12:37pm] ardissone|away: notes Agendas have linked that page since ss made it 
[12:37pm] mento: gcc 4.0 = smaller code = make up for shipping larger symbol tables
[12:37pm] ss: Heh
[12:37pm] ardissone|away: for 1.6 only, right?
[12:37pm] mento: certainly
[12:37pm] mento: 1.5's done
[12:37pm] jeff joined the chat room.
[12:37pm] jeff was promoted to operator by you.
[12:38pm] ardissone|away: tinderboxen?
[12:38pm] mento: …and if apple releases gcc 4.2, i might want to switch everything over to that - smaller code still 
[12:38pm] ss: Waiting for them to make a colo trip
[12:38pm] mento: DOH
[12:38pm] ardissone|away: minibinus is there, right?
[12:38pm] ss: Somehow we lost access to the boxes.
[12:38pm] ardissone|away: just not accessibkle
[12:38pm] ss: And minimaya01
[12:38pm] ss: But we can't access them.
[12:38pm] mento: miniosx01's working and reachable though
[12:39pm] ardissone|away: of course no random orange since you applied that patch 
[12:39pm] mento: yeah, sucks
[12:40pm] ardissone|away: jeff: any news on tabs quickly?  i told them what i told you last night
[12:41pm] jeff: I can easily have a patch up today for dragging without scrolling over
[12:41pm] ardissone|away: (still animated, right?)
[12:42pm] jeff: oh yea
[12:42pm] ardissone|away: k
[12:42pm] ardissone|away: sounds good 
[12:42pm] jeff: I just really wanted to be able to ship with the tab being able to shift over when the user dragged it to the far left or right when there were overflow tabs
[12:43pm] ss: Yeah, Firefox does that, but without animation.
[12:43pm] jeff: I think with our current tab implementation it is becoming to hackish to do fancy things with animation and views with a scrolling tab bar
[12:43pm] jeff: but yea, I think what we have now will still be better than FF
[12:43pm] cl: jeff: you missed it earlier, but apparently neither Sf or Fx does the scrolling + dragging properly
[12:44pm] jeff: ok, I won't get down on myself too much then 
[12:44pm] ardissone|away: oh, heh
[12:44pm] ardissone|away: i never held the tab over far enough to make it scroll 
[12:44pm] ss: Yeah, it scrolls just fine.
[12:44pm] ardissone|away: well, we can be p-safari at least
[12:45pm] ss: Yeah...
[12:45pm] ardissone|away: mento: still here, or eating?
[12:45pm] ss: "yay"
[12:45pm] ss:
[12:46pm] ardissone|away: i guess eating 
[12:46pm] ardissone|away: we'll hold off on re-discussing bug 408593 again, then
[12:47pm] ardissone|away: so, we fixed about 20 bugs since last meeting 
[12:47pm] smorgan: So LS on my laptop seems to be really confused, btw
[12:47pm] smorgan: And keeps losing my browser pref
[12:47pm] ardissone|away:
[12:49pm] ardissone|away: besides nib/strings related bugs, the other thing we really need to drive (ss) for b1 is the "theme refresh"
[12:49pm] ardissone|away: s/b1/b2/
[12:49pm] ss: Yeah
[12:49pm] ss: I've been trying.
[12:49pm] ardissone|away: i know you've been doing some work
[12:49pm] ss: sighs again.
[12:50pm] ss: Multi-channel sigh ftw!
[12:50pm] ardissone|away: haha
[12:50pm] ardissone|away: that's really all i have this week
[12:50pm] ardissone|away: anyone else have anything?
[12:52pm] smorgan: I'm trying to rename the background tab pref at the moment, so if anyone has brainstorms please post in bug 381356
[12:52pm] smorgan: I'm trying to fix that bug at the same time as making it only apply to tabs
[12:52pm] ardissone|away: ?
[12:53pm] smorgan: We have the bug about renaming that pref, and also the bug about making it not apply to windows
[12:53pm] smorgan: I'm trying to fix the latter, so fixing the former while changing that string anyway seemed like a good idea
[12:53pm] ardissone|away: oh
[12:54pm] ardissone|away: so window users will have no way to open windows in the bg afterwards?
[12:54pm] smorgan: Shift
[12:54pm] ardissone|away: but no toggle
[12:55pm] smorgan: If there is significant outcry, we can add a new pref
[12:55pm] smorgan: correc
[12:55pm] smorgan: t
[12:55pm] ardissone|away: it seems odd to break parity, but ok
[12:55pm] smorgan: parity with what?
[12:55pm] ardissone|away: tabs
[12:56pm] smorgan: Well, having them controlled the same way is just not sensible
[12:57pm] smorgan: And opening lots of background windows is really not as usable as opening a bunch of background tabs, so I'm not convinced there is parity no matter what
[12:58pm] smorgan: But if a lot of people really want control over that for windows, we'll look into another pref
[12:58pm] ardissone|away: k
[12:58pm] smorgan: (s/the same way/by the same pref/)
[12:59pm] ardissone|away: that i can agree with 
[1:00pm] ardissone|away: anything else today?
[1:04pm] ss: Nope. Have a good day everyone
[1:04pm] ardissone|away: yep, and a good week
[1:04pm] cl: indeed
[1:04pm] cl: have fun macworlding, all of you in CA