Status Meetings:2009-01-28:Log
Jump to navigation
Jump to search
[02:14am] You were promoted to operator by chanserv. [02:14am] You changed the topic to "http://wiki.caminobrowser.org/Status_Meetings:2009-01-28:Agenda". [11:49am] murph joined the chat room. [12:00pm] murph was promoted to operator by you. [12:01pm] hendy joined the chat room. [12:01pm] jeff joined the chat room. [12:01pm] jeff was promoted to operator by chanserv. [12:01pm] hendy was promoted to operator by you. [12:01pm] ardissone: jeff [12:01pm] jeff: yea I know [12:01pm] mento joined the chat room. [12:01pm] mento was promoted to operator by chanserv. [12:01pm] jeff: shrugs head [12:01pm] kreeger joined the chat room. [12:02pm] kreeger was promoted to operator by you. [12:02pm] peeja_ joined the chat room. [12:02pm] peeja_ was promoted to operator by you. [12:02pm] ardissone: mento: do you know if we're expecting your compatriots? [12:02pm] mento: dunno but i know pink's around somewhere [12:03pm] ardissone: if you stumble upon him, can you remind him it's Wed Camino meeting time? [12:05pm] mento: pink not coming [12:05pm] ardissone: ok [12:06pm] ardissone: thanks [12:06pm] ardissone: let's give smorgan a few and then get started [12:06pm] smorgan joined the chat room. [12:06pm] smorgan was promoted to operator by you. [12:06pm] ardissone: or 30s [12:07pm] ardissone: ok, everyone open your Camino 2.0b1 or newer to http://wiki.caminobrowser.org/Status_Meetings:2009-01-28:Agenda [12:09pm] ardissone: there's nothing really new in crashes [12:09pm] ardissone: we only added 10 in the last week [12:09pm] ardissone: the new crash is nsObjectFrame::PaintPlugin [12:10pm] ardissone: which is Gecko and plugins, but there was nothing useful in the reports [12:11pm] ardissone: on the 1.6.x front, nothing new either [12:11pm] ardissone: talkback still refuses to cooperate [12:12pm] ardissone: the only real other issue we have with 1.6.x is the 10.3 OpenSearch bug [12:13pm] ilya joined the chat room. [12:13pm] ardissone: and if i can catch murph some time, we can hopefully do more investigation [12:13pm] ilya was promoted to operator by you. [12:13pm] murph: yes I definitely want to take care of that! [12:14pm] ardissone: on to 2.0 then [12:14pm] ardissone: we've discovered two new old Gecko bugs this week [12:15pm] ardissone: Bug 474406 - CPU usage peaking at 100% on Lufthansa website (regression from 2007) [12:15pm] ardissone: don't try to book with Lufthansa and Camino [12:16pm] ardissone: ss: can you look at the regression range bugs and see who we might need to cc to look at that? [12:16pm] ardissone: and Bug 475102 - Can't switch tabs with the keyboard on whitehouse.gov (regression from keyhell) [12:16pm] ss: Heh [12:16pm] ss: Key hell bugs are likely smichaud and/or josh. [12:16pm] ardissone: no, i mean lufthansa [12:17pm] ss: Oh, sure [12:17pm] ardissone: i know who's responsible for keyhell [12:17pm] ss: $DEITY help us [12:17pm] ardissone: the only good news out of Gecko is that smichaud's patch fixes both the 10.5 crash-on-quit and the 10.4-autorelease leak [12:18pm] ardissone: of course it will probably be march before it lands on 1.9.0 [12:19pm] ss: With antiphishing... [12:19pm] ss: We have permission to use Google-only lists [12:19pm] ss: So I've asked murph to update his patch so we can get it checked in soon. [12:20pm] smorgan: w00t! [12:20pm] ss: I'm still working with Google on the details, but we should be able to get it in in the next week or two. [12:20pm] murph: yeah, I'm refreshing the patch right now. Very exciting to hear [12:20pm] ss: (And we have to switch to v2.2 of the protocol, which should be pretty easy.) [12:20pm] ardissone: sam's been working really hard on this for the past few months [12:21pm] murph: Yeah, switching to 2.2, from 2.0, is mostly just changing the URLs in prefs from what I see so far [12:21pm] ss: I'd prefer to land it asap and work on the smaller details later because I think there'll be some follow-ups from it. [12:21pm] ardissone: yeah, we need more UI [12:21pm] ss: And we want any string changes in before b2 [12:21pm] ss: Yeah [12:21pm] ss: So heads up that that's coming. [12:21pm] murph: I'll do my best to have this in maybe even today, or tomorrow. [12:22pm] ss: Thanks murph [12:22pm] ardissone: thanks ss [12:22pm] murph: oh no prob, thank you for making this happen! [12:22pm] ss: If there are any changes of significance, send it back through sr to smorgan, I htink. [12:22pm] ss: think* [12:22pm] ss: If it's just small changes, it's probably good, but you're the best judge of that. [12:23pm] murph: ok, will do. [12:23pm] ardissone: murph also has a patch for the 10.4 dragging bug now [12:24pm] murph: yeah, that was bad, it didn't work at all on Tiger [12:25pm] ardissone: i think that means that feature will be back in shippable state, which is good [12:25pm] ardissone: because, uh, tabsposé isn't quite done [12:25pm] jeff: runs [12:25pm] jeff: yea so I gotta get on that ... [12:26pm] ss: And soon! [12:26pm] ss: [12:26pm] ardissone: jeff keeps mentioning patches, then disappearing [12:26pm] ardissone: he's a terrible tease [12:26pm] jeff: murph owes me a tutorial to get my local tree cleaned up [12:26pm] jeff: the Osbourne 2 is gonna be awesome! [12:27pm] ardissone: we need to fix the focus loss, and probably the inaccessibility from the keyboard [12:27pm] ardissone: and then whatever bling jeff can work up, like the fading [12:28pm] jeff: yea thats a quick fix from murph's review [12:28pm] jeff: and the focus stuff I will look into [12:28pm] jeff: and then there is the NSControl magic [12:28pm] ardissone: mhm [12:28pm] jeff: so basically I better shape up and fast [12:28pm] ardissone: which will help with the keyboard [12:28pm] ardissone: indeed [12:29pm] jeff: on another note, I converted 2 people to Camino [12:29pm] ardissone: [12:29pm] jeff: this week* [12:29pm] ardissone: [12:29pm] ardissone: so you'd better make it rock for them l;) [12:30pm] jeff: how many horses has murph converted over? [12:30pm] jeff: leaves the floor for murph [12:30pm] ardissone: ilya: what's next for you? [12:30pm] murph: haha, well at least I didn't need to mention converts to score back some meeting points for my patches ! [12:31pm] ardissone: (growl landed, in case you missed it) [12:31pm] ilya: mmm, downloads stuff I guess [12:31pm] ilya: currently, catching up on school work [12:31pm] ardissone: [12:31pm] jeff: I'll use that excuse too [12:31pm] jeff: [12:32pm] ardissone: mento / smorgan: is that Ts hit expected from shared builds? [12:32pm] smorgan: has no idea [12:32pm] ardissone: we had a 10% Ts hit on boxset with the landing [12:33pm] ardissone: boxset also had a hit with Sparkle [12:33pm] smorgan: If it's only shared I'm not really worried [12:33pm] ardissone: yeah [12:33pm] ardissone: binus even had a Ts win [12:33pm] pinkerton joined the chat room. [12:33pm] pinkerton was promoted to operator by chanserv. [12:33pm] pinkerton: still going? [12:33pm] ardissone: there's pink [12:33pm] pinkerton: sorry was on a call [12:33pm] ardissone: yep [12:34pm] ardissone: np [12:34pm] ardissone: we're discussing the Growl Ts hit on shared [12:34pm] ardissone: http://wiki.caminobrowser.org/Status_Meetings:2009-01-28:Agenda [12:34pm] pinkerton: ah [12:34pm] ardissone: somewhere down in there [12:34pm] ardissone: is a Ts hit expected from adding a framework in a shared build? [12:35pm] pinkerton: i wouldn't imagine so [12:35pm] pinkerton: what is growl doing at init time? [12:35pm] ardissone: ilya: ^^^ [12:35pm] ilya: umm, not a whole lot [12:35pm] mento: i don't know about the ts hit. what landing caused it? [12:36pm] ardissone: Growl [12:36pm] mento: oh, you said it below [12:36pm] mento: yes [12:36pm] ardissone: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=475571 [12:36pm] ilya: a GrowlController is inited, which tries to register with Growl [12:36pm] mento: yes, that's entirely plausible [12:36pm] ilya: this is basically a no-op if Growl is not there [12:36pm] ilya: s / there / installed [12:37pm] ardissone: (we had a similar, but not as severe, hit on boxset with Sparkle) [12:37pm] pinkerton: is growl on the tboxes? [12:37pm] ardissone: no [12:37pm] pinkerton: so it should be a no-op [12:37pm] mento: i think that the problem is that dyld's workload is just plain heavier with the shared build [12:37pm] mento: it's not really a growl or sparkle or framework problem [12:37pm] mento: it's a huge symbol table to resolve problem that has just gotten huger [12:38pm] pinkerton: k. so no impact on static builds? [12:38pm] ardissone: (cb-miniosx is also shared, but runs no tests, so we can't correlate) [12:38pm] pinkerton: (which is what we really care about) [12:38pm] mento: i would expect impact but much less severe [12:38pm] ardissone: Ts win on the one mini, no change on the Xserve [12:38pm] mento: fantastic [12:39pm] ardissone: ok, then I'll close that bug and the sparkle one as dyld's fault [12:39pm] pinkerton: ship it [12:39pm] ardissone: speaking of which [12:39pm] ardissone: smorgan: any news on the breakpad front? [12:39pm] smorgan: No; I was sick most of the last week [12:40pm] ardissone: hopes you're feeling better [12:40pm] mento: you guys should just do what i do and do the linking/loading step in your heads. no more pesky os to get in the way. [12:40pm] ardissone: haha [12:40pm] ardissone: philippe's got new icon variants for us for zoom [12:41pm] ardissone: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=450542 [12:41pm] ardissone: 10.5: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=359029 [12:41pm] ardissone: 10.4: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=359030 [12:41pm] ardissone: I like A3 the best, I think [12:42pm] ardissone: the Cs look like they're adding a new blue color, which makes people yell at us [12:42pm] ss: We should do this in two steps: Pick a color, then pick a style. [12:42pm] ardissone: the green just looks unattractive [12:43pm] pinkerton: F is kinda cool [12:43pm] hendy: yeah, i like F [12:43pm] pinkerton: for some reason when i look at the As i see a white checkerboard, rather than the arrows [12:43pm] smorgan: We could do F with blue [12:43pm] smorgan: er, blue-matching [12:44pm] smorgan: (stupid - key) [12:44pm] ardissone: ok [12:44pm] ardissone: any other thoughts? [12:44pm] ilya: in F, the negative-space arrows seem really prominent to me [12:44pm] smorgan: If we go A, I would say 5 or 3 [12:45pm] smorgan: I'm also against green [12:45pm] smorgan: C3 with a slightly different blue would also work [12:46pm] ardissone: i don't notice the negative-space much in these compared to previous revisions [12:46pm] hendy: C3 has even more prominent neg-space arrows for me [12:47pm] pinkerton: yeah, the neg space in Cs is more prominant than the F for me [12:47pm] hendy: F is the only one where it doesn't pop right out [12:47pm] ardissone: ok...we like them all, except Green [12:47pm] hendy: maybe a first-run dialog where the user can choose his favourite? [12:48pm] pinkerton: my vote is F [12:48pm] ardissone: roll call! [12:49pm] ardissone: do we prefer blue, or grey? [12:50pm] ss: I'm okay with the F style, but I want to see maybe one or two variations of color. [12:50pm] ss: And yeah, feels like we're adding a new color to our palette. [12:50pm] ss: (Man, we're anal!) [12:50pm] hendy: i'd go for a blue like the reload button [12:50pm] hendy: ss: perfectionists [12:50pm] pinkerton: it already looks close to that [12:50pm] ss: It's close, but a little off. [12:50pm] ardissone: yeah, the blue'd have to match reload a little better [12:51pm] ardissone: moving on [12:51pm] ardissone: hendy: UTF-8 news and such? [12:52pm] hendy: nearly there; the user-exposed urls are all nearly cleaned up [12:52pm] ardissone: bookmarks manager is really all that's left, right? [12:53pm] hendy: i still need to tackle the pasteboard stuff, and make sure both url types are in there somewhere [12:53pm] hendy: bookmarks and history, yes [12:53pm] ardissone: OK [12:54pm] ilya_ joined the chat room. [12:54pm] ilya_ was promoted to operator by you. [12:54pm] ilya_: brb [12:54pm] ardissone: heh [12:54pm] ilya_ left the chat room. (Quit: ilya_) [12:55pm] ardissone: anyone have anything else on 2.0? [12:55pm] ardissone: hopefully the post-Christmas lull is starting to break [12:56pm] ilya left the chat room. (Ping timeout) [12:56pm] ss: I wanted to mention one more thing before we break [12:57pm] ss: I've been digging into our update stats a bit and I'm going to break them down more. [12:57pm] ss: I'll send a spreadsheet to anyone who wants [12:57pm] ss: But it looks like we're getting ~85k daily pings on a good day [12:57pm] smorgan: I'd be interested in the data [12:57pm] ss: (With a 3x multiplier, puts us at ~250k monthlies) [12:58pm] ss: I can send you whatever you'd like, but the raw data is hefty [12:58pm] pinkerton: kwl [12:58pm] smorgan: broken down is fine [12:58pm] ss: Right now I'm breaking it down in some basic ways (by version, by platform) [12:58pm] ss: But I'm not doing the more detailed stuff (1.6.6 by platform, for example) [12:59pm] ss: smorgan: I'll send you a spreadsheet later this week and you can let me know if you want other data. :) [12:59pm] smorgan: thanks [12:59pm] ss: Anyway, this is up from April/May when we were at 35k pings [12:59pm] ss: Thought it was an interesting stat. :) [1:00pm] ss: That's all I had. :) [1:00pm] ardissone: anyone else have anything else today? [1:02pm] ardissone: ok then [1:02pm] ardissone: everyone have a good week, and keep hacking those bugs and the r queue :) [1:02pm] pinkerton: l8r all [1:02pm] pinkerton left the chat room.